Chase: Kimbo would knock Royce into next week! WTF r u talking about?

Word.

I dont respect Royce to much as a fighter. THe Gracie that I bow down to is Renzo! Renzo is a god in my eyes. Renzo has been successful since fighters began cross training. Royce was only successful when his opponents didnt even know what Ju JItsu was.

LOL, an old Royce submits kimbo with ease. Phil, I really would rather hear your onsight (you train more than most of us and are very knowledgeable), instead you constantly type “word,” “couldn’t agree more,: “great comment’”…give us your thoughts!!

Kev: I really never thought about it till this discussion. As much as I am a BJJ guy.. there are too many clouds in my mind about Royce.. he is without a doubt one of hte most important fighters in the history of American MMA. If he would of fought Kimbo ( of today) in 1993 through 1995..he would have a chance.. a slight cahnce.. but if the
royce who juiced up for Saku part 2..and the one who fought
hughes in 2006..would get destroyed by Kimbo today. Kimbo knows just enough to avoid anything Royce will try to apply on him..Kimbo has size..athletism..power.. continuing with MMA legends such as Bas..is what I weigh in my mind when I think of Royce vs Kimbo.. How would you think Royce would do against the 2-1 Brock Lesnar.. I know. Real Bad.

Lesner would get submitted…or kill him, it’s a coin toss. Kimbo has zero cardio (jame thoimson fight) and zero ground game (got swept easily b thompson). He’d beat Kimbo, coin toss lesner. I agree he’s the reason the sport is what it is today, and in the early days he won because no one knew what a triangle or arm bar was!

TODAY, Royce would NEVER beat Kimbo. Kevin, are you loosing your mind? Back when Royce was winning, his opponents didnt even know what jits was and they had NO takedown defense. Royce would never get kimbo to the mat, and Kimbo might punch a whole through Royce. No question in my mind that if they fought TOday, Royce would get killed.

Kimbo lost me when he said that Thompson had a good chin. Kimbo could maybe beat today’s Royce, but I honestly can’t think of a current UFC HW fighter that would not be able to take out Kimbo. Kimbo has a ground game that makes Houston Alexander look like Jacare.

Are you kiddin’? Houston looking like JAcare as compared to Kimbo’s ground game? It must be the other way around…

stop trying to be like me Mex, its not working for you!

u know why I do not take cheap shots at kimbo? Because I do not know how much of his BS quality of opponents have been his fault. Kimbo is a fighter at HEART, that can NOT be disputed. So I find it hard to believe that he would DUCK anyone. I have a feeling that its Elite who is insisting on building him up by fighting cans. Not saying kimbo is a top 10 fighter because he is far from it, Im saying I dont blame him as much as the rest of you for the tight leash that Elite has him on!

You’re right about Elite, John. I would have far less of a problem with all this if Elite would promote him as what he is, which is a tough, powerful, hard-hitting inexperienced up and coming fighter. Instead they insist on calling him this unbeatable internet sensation, playing up the whole street fighting thing (bad for MMA), then don’t let him back those claims up with competitive fights. I would have way more respect for him if he fought a legitimate fighter, win or lose, rather than fighting washed up guys like Tank and Shammy.

exactly!

W/e the point is that Kimbo does not belong on any major MMA scene. He does not have the skills to hang with any guy and the point is, if you don’t stand a chance to ever beat the best, which I would put my life that he will never beat anyone who actually matters, then you shouldn’t be fighting on the major scene.

I don’t think Kimbo is dodging anyone but I don’t think that matters because if he weren’t being protected by EXC he’d be losing. Point is I have a fighting spirit, I love to spar and I’ll go for hours on end without taking a break but that doesn’t mean that I belong on the big screen fighting eh?

He does not have the skills to hang with ANY guy? Are you serious? If you can ball up your fists and have a pair of nuts to step into the cage you can hang with anybody. I bet you have NEVER had a fight in your life. What a douche

That is not true at all. Just because someone can ball up their fists and step in a cage doesn’t mean they can hang with someone like Anderson Silva or George St. Pierre. You don’t need to be in a cage to know that. If you have ever rolled on a mat, sparred in a ring, or even fought in a point fighting tournement for that matter, it is obvious that some people just to do not have what it takes to fight at certain levels. I can run while holding a ball, that doesn’t mean I could “hang” in the NFL.

Look Kory, man, trust me, I’m NOT on the Kimbo bandwagon. By a LOOOOOONG shot. But, whether we like or not, he’s the one being covered by ESPN, on the cover of magazines, and the guy who people talk about. The hardcore fans may not like him, but you’re avg person on the streed knows who he is. He’s the “face” simply because he’s recognizable, not b/c he’s the best. It kills me, but (and this happens every single time I go out to watch ANY MMA event) I either get into arguements with people who think he’s Christ’s second coming, or I eavesdrop conversations about him. I bet it’s happened to every one of us on this site.

He’s not the face of MMA, he’s the face of what people who know nothing of MMA think MMA is. And people who know nothing of MMA include Kornheiser, Wilbon, LeBatard and every other PTI host.

And when you boil it down, what’s the difference? I’m not defending him by any stretch, but I think you guys are letting your dislike of him and hatred of his popularity cloud the facts. He’s not the face to people who regularly follow the sport, but when asked about MMA or Kimbo, the avg joe associates them before anyone else. Look, I HATE this as much as you guys, but I believe it to be true nonetheless.

PW-

TRUTH !!!

Chef-

I agree w/ what you say in principle. BTW, I like Kimbo’s attitude. Its the circus over him that I hate.

However, PW brought up a dimension to this entire Kimbo debate that most tend to ignore.

I agree he is huge in MMA now and the average person on the street might know who he is… but i think that average person would also know who chuck is too so I wouldn’t give him the face of MMA.. but yes he is way too popular

OJR, it’s not to be disrespectful to PW at all, but that point is moot. Perception is reality, and the reality is that he is the most recognized to your avg person. Hell man, I hate the hype train too. But I hate Elite for it, not Kimbo. And it’s the hype train that makes him so recognizable as well as youtube. I HATE IT. But more people have heard of him than most others, whether they follow the sport at all is beside the point. I do agree that the guys from PTI would stand a better chance of designing a working spaceship than accurately commenting on MMA though.

And make no mistake guys, I’m wrong a LOT! lol. on this topic I hope, NAY, I PRAY that I’m woefully, horribly wrong.

Chef-

I don’t think you are wrong at all. As I posted before, I agree w/ you in principle.

However, perception NEVER EVER equals reality.

That’s a long overused cliche meant to justify ignorance of a certain subject.

Example : Serra is a better fighter than BJ Penn because he beat GSP once(and BJ did not).

Perception.

BJ Penn is a better fighter than Serra.

Reality.

BTW – I like Kimbo’s personality. I doubt Bas Rutten would take an arrogant punk under his wing.

OJR, I’m laughing my @ss off at work, b/c this discussion has spurred a HUGE debate here. IMO, there is only one person who can end this: Ken Shamrock. Hopefully he derails the hype train, otherwise we will have to listen to people say,”but why are you guys dissin’ Kimbo, he just beat the World’s MOst Dangerous Man.” And While I agree with your example (in principle, lol) above, in my line of work (as I’ve found with sales and marketing as well), I will have to stubbornly stick by my above sentiment. Oh well, let’s call this a day, and in the unfortunately immortal words of Jim “Big Pu$$y” Rome: “WAR” Shamrock.

As an addendum to my previous comment above, Fergie is the face of MMA to the know-nothing crowd. Unfortunately a lot of people in this know-nothing crowd have very public and popular forums in which to propogate their know-nothingness. Therefore, millions of other MMA know-nothings in the population at large are being told by trusted sources that Fergie is the face of MMA, are watching backyard beatings and equating it with MMA, then further spreading this false prophesy. Now we have to rely on Ken Oldrock to take Fergie down and take his leg off with a non-surgical procedure in two minutes and derail the hype train.

Gentlemen, I have truly enjoyed this as it has been a distraction from a truly boring @ss day. lol. Let us all now bow our heads and pray that Ken will take Kimbo to the ground and not try to stand with him as he said would. If Ken wins we can all have a moment of silence for the passing of Kimbo’s 15 minutes of fame.

PW and Chef-

Great debate. Amen!

First of all you have to give respect to a dude who can step into that ring and risk getting killed, put in a coma, having a body part broken, dude probably has 2% body fat, so he trains takes it seriously, whats the joke? How does that make him a joke? What do you do for a living? I bet 99% of people would say YOU are a joke compared to Kimbo. You probably have “gogo plata” tattoed on your butt cheeks, how can you be a snobby high brow type in a sport that almost 15 years after the first UFC match is STILL looked at as human chicken fighting. Thats like having snobby water polo fans or “hardcore” beach volley ball fans. Get a life.

I appreciate everyone who steps in the ring/octagon. However, there is NO evidence that Kimbo is an elite fighter. Name one person he’s fought who has been competitive in the UFC, which is (like it or not) the top of the sport today.

As far as me, I’m not a joke, I don’t have “gogo plata” tattooed on my ass, and I have a very nice, very comfortable life. Consider anger management therapy.

PLEASE provide a link either written or video where Kimbo says he’s an “elite” fighter, lets say even anybody who trains with him or trains him (Bas)that says he’s an “elite” fighter. Ive seen him on ESPN, ESPN the mag, E60, Commercials,youtube, articles, Ive never seen or read him say anything other than he’s still learning. Question, when you started at Burger King did they let you go from fries to manager in a week or a month or 6 months? No you had to be patient and learn fries first, then they moved you to register and now you manage. Thats what Kimbo is doing

I agree, Kimbo’s quite humble. However, if you’ve conceded that he’s not elite (meaning he isn’t one of the best fighters), then what is he doing on ESPN? Answer: “Kimbo is a good quote, as they would say in the media business. That and his looks make him a more entertaining interview than most other fighters.”

As far as evidence for other people saying he is elite, see exhibit A:
http://www.cagepotato.com/2008/06/04/gary-shaw-thinks-kimbo-is-mmas-best-heavyweight-striker-among-other-things/

If he’s not yet elite, and he gets beat by a tomato can (Shamrock) than Kimbo<Tomato Can. If so, he doesn’t belong on ESPN for anything other than entertainment value.

Regarding your continued need to insult rather than make valid points, I pity you. I can assure you that if I did work at Burger King, I’d be good at my job, respected for it, and feel good about my contribution to the company. Got a problem with that?

One he tenses his stomach muscles up. The biggest thing though is that he times the punch. When kimbo punches he moves back slightly and then at the point of contact he goes with the punch. I’m sure it took a lot of practice to time it right without making it look obivious.

Interesting. But I don’t think I’ll be trying it anytime soon!