Props: UFC.com
Quoteworthy:
“On July 20, UFC Welterweight Champion Georges St-Pierre will attempt to become the first mixed martial artist to win an ESPN ESPY award, as he has been nominated for the ‘Best Fighter’ award following a 12 month period that has seen him decision Josh Koscheck, submit Matt Hughes, and TKO Matt Serra to regain his 170-pound crown. St-Pierre’s competitors in the ‘Best Fighter’ category include boxers Joe Calzaghe, Holly Holm, Floyd Mayweather Jr., and Kelly Pavlik…. The award show airs on ESPN on Sunday, July 20th at 9pm ET.”
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July 2nd, 2008
121 Comments »
GSP should win it since he can beat up all the other nominees! That seems like a pretty good way to select the best fighter to me.
The WAMMA rankings are: http://www.gowamma.com/rankings.asp
This was brought up in an earlier thread and someone had asked for people’s opinions on them but got no response. I wanted to answer, but no one would see that stale thread…
Anyways, I was just looking at the rankings, and here’s what sticks out to me:
HW: Gabe Gonzaga at Number 8? I think that is a bit high. With an impressive performance against Justin Eilers, I see Antonio Silva moving off the honorable mentions, and onto the Top 10 list.
LHW: Chuck at number 2 and ahead of Machida? CLEARLY the #2 LHW in the world right now is Lyoto Machida. Fighters ranked #1, 2, and 4 (Machida is #3) have recenlty said that they do not want a fight with Machida. And its NOT because they think it would be a boring fight. With the lone exception of the 1 fight of the night bonus per card, you get paid the same if you win a boring fight or an exciting fight. Also, Tito and James Irvin do not deserve to be recieving votes. A flash KO over the 1 dimensional and super over rated Houston Alexander gets you votes for WAMMA?
MW: No doubts about it, Matt Lindland is a Top 5 MW. He needs to leave his weightclass and move up just to find fights. Not many people want to fight Lindland. Also, I am suspecting that Frank Trigg is a member of the nomination committee because I can’t think of anyone else that would have voted for Trigg to be a Top 10 MW. Yeah, Ricardo Almeida just came back, but he should definitely be mentioned. With a win over Cote, he is going to come storming onto that Top 10 list with authority.
WW: I don’t like Kos as a Top 5 WW in the world, but then again, I just don’t like Kos! If the WEC would somehow get better talent to face Carlos Condit, than The Natural Born Killer would still be ranked higher.
LW: All I got to say about the LW list is - WHERE THE F IS JOSH THOMSON???
That’s what the Violent One thinks, what do YOU guys think?
I dont think Jake shields is the third best at 170 right now. Hes top ten but not 3rd.
Lindland is very good but i dont think he could beat any of the top 5 fighters at 185. I agree with you about ALmeida. He should be in the top 10 with a few more fights. Bisping is definitly not top 10. or top 20.
Lyoto is definitly #2 right now. other than that i agree with those rankingss.
The punk is definitly top ten.
i think the HW rankings are good how they are.
I GOT A RESPONSE!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks JRV. You are probably the one that asked in the Forrest/Machida thread earlier. I never went back to check…
The rankings arent as bad as I thought they would be. I posted a link to view the Wama title belt under the Forrest scared of machida thread.
Have no fear, Almeida will be up there after this weekend.
Sheilds looks like a Dean Lister’s little brother. Sheilds is a MOster, #3 I dont know, he could be, but I wouuld have to see him fight some top UFC welterweights to know for sure where he belongs.
I really dont think Forrest should be #4. He only has 1 relevant win in his entire UFC career (Shogun) and that win should have an asterix next to it in my book. Everytime Forrest has been in a relevant uFC fight he has lost: TIto, Jardine….I dunno but I dont think 1 good win should get you into the top 5 of the best division in all of mma! Sorry!
Its a shame because I was a HUGE forrest Griffin fan until everyone started over rating him…now, not so much!
Koschek is in no way a top 4 welterweight world wide, and his striking is very over rated, all he does is throw those wild haymaker overhand punches….His game is weak and its going to be LIghts out for Kos on Saturday!
What, Koscheck is a brown belt in BJJ and he out boxed Deigo Sanchez and Dustin Hanzelette, both of whom looked impressive last week. As for Kos not being a legitimate top five welterweight, I say get out of town. His only losses in the UFC have come against Georges St. Pierre (can anybody balme him for losing?) and a fluke knee which lead to a choke against Drew Ficket. He holds wins over Deigo Sanchez, former champ Dave Menne, and the allways tough veterine Pete Spratt. Sound like a top five welterweight to me. As for Lytle, This is his third and final chance to get a title shot. The first came against Matt Serra in the TUF 4 finale where he lost a less then impressive split decision which was razor thin, the next oppertunity came against Matt Hugh where he was simply physically overwelmed. Now he has one last shot against Kos. I really like Chris Lytle, but I think Koscheck has all the tools to win this fight.
Ya, Kos will win for sure,and Cote is going to win also.
I agree with you about Keith Jardine, he should be an honorable mention right now at best.
Lyota Machida should not be # 2 because he hasn’t beat anyone in the top 10 in the LHW division.
There is a couple reason people don’t want to fight Machida:
He makes you look bad because he won’t engage, and the fight is inevitably not going to be crowd pleasing.
He also has an odd style, so you have to train differently and come up with a game plan to be able to catch him, all this takes more time.
So you have to train longer for a fight that fans are going to hate, so why would anyone want to fight him?
WOW, Keith Jardine never even entered my mind. He really needs to find himself a personality because he is just sooooo forgettable exept for his fights against Alexander and Wanderlei, where he just so happened to suffer from KO’s from Hell.
You guys could be right. But don’t forget how he embarrased the Iceman and the ever so overrated Forrest Griffin. Well I think I just said it myself! Iceman’s too old, and Forrest’s just over-hyped. He shouldn’t be that high in the rankings!
I totally agree with you about Thompson. What about Jacare? Shouldn’t he at least be in the got votes column.
DonnyG; I am the biggest Jacre fan on this site, and I will answer your question with a: Not Yet! Once he wins the DReam Middleweight grand prix, which he will, he will be added to the list.
Eddie Alverez will be added as well, sooner then later!
well deserved!
GSP should win it because Mandy Moore has a crush on him, meaning that he’s the most handsome. They should also get points for looks…LOL!!
Well if anyone in the UFC deserves it, it’s Anderson Silva! Take nothing away from GSP, but he hasnt defended his title, never mind run through a whole weight class!
Any ways, the way my morning conversations are taking off (like 50 comments nest below todays alone), I guess I’ll keep em coming. Takes a ;lot of thought though, maybe I’ll start charging for them. lol!
But we’ll take GSP too, still representing MMA!
Its nice that he is nominated. but they wont give him the award over all the boxers. Its a shame, but its reality!
The competition GSP faces is stronger then Anderson Silva, is probably the reason for the decision. I’m sure everyone would agree that BJ, GSP, or AS could have been nominated.
I don’t think most of us would agree that BJ should be nominated… a couple of loses at 170 lbs before he took the 155 lb belt… but I’m looking forward to him being nominated in the future!
Anderson Silva would have been the best bet, he whupped long time 185 lb UFC Champion Franklin, and whupped The belt holder of Pride’s former 185 lb and 205 lb division, while handing out multiple title defenses in dominate fashion!
Bingo!!!
You make it sound good, but the truth is he has 3 title defences. Not exactly braking any UFC records yet is he. If you look at their whole fight carreer records, GSP’s is the best. He fought nothing but the best and avenged his only 2 losses in pure anialation. GSP deserves it. Lastly I think GSP has been more dominant throughout the fight against his opponents. I know Silva has turned it up at the end and won in dominant fashion, but there were times he was losing (Hendo winning the 1st round). The only thing Silva has over GSP, is he hasn’t had a bad night (YET), in the UFC.
2 of GSP’s last 4 fights were against MATT SERRA!!!!!! and he infamously lost one of them. And he fought a WASHED UP Matt Hughes. Also, a win over Kos, by decision. How can you say that that is tougher competition than what Anderson faced? Finishing Hendo along is a bigger accomplishment than any of GSP’s last 3 wins!
Not true. GSP was obligated to fight Serra both times. Hughes was in his prime and had just smashed BJ Penn until GSP ran over him - then Hughes beat Lytle, and then GSP ran over him again. Koscheck is a Top 5 WW who GSP dominated. Henderson is a great win, but Henderson has more good wins at 205 than 185. At 185 Hendo recently lost to Misaki.
Obligated or not, what is the difference?
Also, he just fought Hughes 7 months ago.
So Serra and Hendo are on the same level now? Plus Anderson beat Rich Franklin TWICE and he is #2 ranked MW on WAMMA. And Nate Marquardt who is ranked.
This is not an argument that you can win, but unfortunately, I’m done posting for the day (out of work)
LOL at you. Matt Hughes and Koscheck are Top 5 WWs, and Serra was the UFC champ. It’s not even arguable that GSP was beaten the best competition of any UFC fighter. Just look up his opponents and their win %, and the number of champions he’s beaten. If destroying Matt Hughes 2x doesn’t count for much, then beating Rich Franklin 2x counts for even less. Good luck with that line of reasoning.
I am still waiting for him to successfully defend his title.
Anderson’s reign has been much more impressive. He destroyed Rich Franklin twice, who was the best middleweight champion the UFC had ever had to that point, and then he finished Henderson, the Pride Champion, who has only been submitted twice prior to that, by the Nogueira twins.
I am a big gSP fan, but nothing equals the terror that Silva has brought onto the UFC’s middleweight division.
Anderson is like a 4 or 5 time defending uFC champion. Gsp has never defended the title!
I got to go with Silva!
Defend the title or not, GSP has still run through the division. Hughes (2), Kos, Serra, Sherk, BJ, Trigg, Mayhem, Heiron, etc. and soon to be Fitch.. That’s a long list of top tier fighters, and aside from Hughes, Penn and Matt “The Horse Shoe” Serra, none of them have even made it competitive. Anderson is a bad dude, but I still think GSP is just as deserving of this award, I just wouldn’t say it to Silva’s face..
Gotta go w/ john and VM on this one. Silva’s accomplishments are much more impressive.
GSP is still a badass, though.
Try 3 defences John. VM, you can’t have it both ways. You say Hughes is washed up and then you say Hendo is a bigger acomplishment. Have you even concidered that a 37 year old Hendo ain’t what he used to be. He LOST his last 2 fights also. Also I think it’s funny that you guys give more credit for beating Franklin twice, than beating Hughes twice. Franklin has like what, 2 title defences and Hughes has 9. Hughes has proved WAAAAY more than Franklin. The MW division is weak. Franklin would still be destroying guys if it wasn’t for Silva.
I’ll go with Silva, hands down. The only guy to spoil it for him was Ryo Chonan. Other than that, the Spider has just breezed through the UFC fighters. And if GSP and the Spider were to face each other, then GSP should better pray hard to his gods because Anderson will sacrilegiously destroy GSP!
The only difference between Silva’s and GSP’s last 6 fights,is GSP had 1 bad night and he fought tougher opponents. Silva beat Franklin twice (no suprise) and Hendo. This is HARDLY the whole weight class, unless you don’t think there are better challenges, than Lebin or lazy ass Luter. Silva still has lots to prove.GSP just has to beat Fitch and Alves and he is done with the WW division.
Can’t compare MMA fighters to boxers…..
It’s like comparing apples and oranges…they are both fruits but….you get my drift.
Wouldn’t it make more sense to have A. Silva nominated since GSP lost in 2007? Either way it’s pretty cool to see a mma guy nominated for an ESPY, hope he wins!!
Anderson silva won the guys choice on spike for deadliest man alive.
I saw that, pretty cool. But that doent’t mean he isn’t eligable for an ESPY.
If you only look at numbers, GSP may be a better choice for the award. His record only has 2 losses, and both have been avenged. They are comparing him to boxers, and in boxing people act like you suck once you lose a fight.
If you look at numbers, Miguel Torres or Faber should be nominated.
If you’re talking about numbers, my man Thiago Silva and Machida should also be nominated! Though they’re just not as mainstream as GSP.
Why is he the only MMA fighter on this list??
Because boxing is the tradition, and mma is the new sport on the block.
espn’s afraid of adding more mma fighters which would make boxers look like nobodies.
Obviously GSP is the best fighter. Boxers are 1 dimensional.
Boxing is not fighting. It’s boxing. BJJ is not fighting. It’s BJJ. Muay Thai is not… It’s…. Judo is not…It’s…Wrestling is not.. Now!! MMA is fighting! Fighting is MMA. So this catergory should only include MMA fighters..not Boxing guys. Get your own catergory.
I think your preaching to the choir on this one, I just wish ESPN saw it the same way.
I disagree… I think all of those forms are fighting. I think you are trying to be too specific. Under your theory, MMA really isn’t fighting either, since it is littered with rules as well. You could say, MMA isn’t fighting cause you can’t kick a downed-opponent for example, where in a “fight” fight, you can. See what I mean? “Best Fighter” is a simplistic way to say “Best Participant in a Combat Sport”. But that title would be too long and sound stupid.
OK..between boxing and MMA..which one has more aspects of a fight. answer: MMA. In boxing..you can only punch!! + with oversize pillows on the hands.
In MMA you can punch, elbow( without the point ), Knee (with limited rules), Kick, takedown, submit. So if you are going to crown the best fighter..wouldn’t it be a MMA fighter..cuz MMA is the closet of the combat sports to real fighting.
I agree with your opinion to a certain extent.
However, I can tell you that boxers do not have oversized pillows on their hands.
I hope you are not implying that boxing is somewhat soft…
you are talking american rules here. mma is anything goes bar eye gouging/biting/fish hooking. just cause the americans have more rules, does not mean “mma” has more rules.
also, please let someone punch you with one of those “oversized pillows” and then say it again.
I being sarcastic with the mention ” over sized pillows “..however if you compare them to official MMA gloves..they can looked at as small pillows. I’ve been hit by boxing gloves and MMA gloves..i got to say..I rather get hit by the boxing gloves hands down.
If you’ve happened to watch this documentary on the NAtional Geographic Channel called Fight Masters, they have this show wherein they featured nothin’ but MMA. The difference in force between boxing gloves and MMA gloves was very very little. The big difference is when you get hit by a bare knuckle fist.
They measures Bas Rutten’s punches in all 3 categories[boxing gloves, MMA gloves, abd the bare fist] and the force of the punching glove and the MMA glove were virtually the same, even if the difference in padding between the MMA and boxing glove were a lot of centimeters apart.
So the myth that “over-sized pillows” for boxing gloves would give you considerably less damage than MMA gloves has just been busted!
Why would GSP get nominated over Anderson? Thats weak, Silva hasnt lost a fight in the octagon and everyone agrees he is arguably pound for pound best fighter in the world…
Dude I’m screaming that people. GSP belongs on this list without a doubt..but Anderson Silva is the best fighter of the year in our F’n Galaxy!!!! He would KO fn aliens with they some Silva.. This espy is crap. Last year at least they had Couture and Rampage on the list..but “Pretty Boy Flyod won it??? That’s bullshit!!!
and he’ll probably win it again this year.
yeah, it wouldn’t surprise me.
I expect he will win it too, especially after the hype for the Hatton fight.
Manny Pacquiao should be nominated as well because he’s the best pound-for-pound boxer in the universe right now[with the departure of “Pretty Boy” Floyd. So this ESPY is , as you’ve guys said, totally bullsh*t!!
You guys are absolutely right, but they’re not going to nominate a guy that doesn’t speak Engligh. It’s total BS, but the bottom line is that GSP is the poster boy for MMA.
For clarification, I mean it’s BS that Anderson’s not nominated because he doesn’t speak Engligh - not BS that GSP is the face of MMA right now. He’s fkn good, he’s classy and he’s an ambassador for the sport.
Bingo. I think him not speaking english has something to do with it. I hope Rush wins, but I bet it’ll be Mayweather.
I think that if the UFC candidate doesn’t win the ESPY, then it will go to Kelly The Ghost Pavlik.
Pavlik drugged up Jermaine Talyor.. it was one of the very few boxing matches I saw and really enjoyed. If it comes down a boxing fighter..I’ll vote for the Ghost.
Yeah, i am a fan of the Ghost for sure, and I havent enjoyed to many other boxing matches lately!
Everyone doesn’t agree… Sorry. I don’t know how many people on here say Fedor is the best. I’m not saying it, but there are people that do say that. So not “everybody”.
Fedor may be the ‘best’ but he needs to start fighting the ‘best’ to prove it… also heavyweight is not the toughest weight class out there.
If it’s like a street fight or somethin’ with no rules, Fedor will kill everyone you feed him. Wouldn’t that be great! I mean if they like place it in a “gladiator-type” of setting where the fighters only have nothin’ to do but kill each other, and without weapons too, just to see who’s the best in hand-to-hand combat, well I guess Fedor will be the champ!
Well considering Boxing is a dieing sport, GSP should take this one. The only Boxing match I’m looking forward to this year is Antonio Margarito/Miguel Cotto.
the people at espn who name the nominees are ignorant and uninformed, still thats no excuse.
yea, that’s true.
Queers
I hope Irvin Ko’s anderson just so i dont have to keep hearing about silva every 5 seconds. Its the damn people on these posts who have turned me from a fan of anderson to someone who is just sick of seeing his name, i respect the guy but espn chose gsp and not him, so get over it and move on. The post isnt about whether gsp or anderson deserved to be nominated. It was supposed to be informative so take it for what it is.
oh please, you were never a fan of anderson. no fan would become a non-fan just because they’d read about them constantly in MMA forums, so stop lying… and anderson silva is the greatest and should be on that list!
man im just saying im sick of hearing about him constantly, you know hes the best, and we dont have to hear it from a billion posters a day, and he ISNT on the list, im not lying about that, oh and i do like the guy, and i definetly enjoy watching him fight, but he needs to lose, he and everyone else need to be brought down to earth, him losing would be good for him and the middleweight/lightheavy divisions
I’m with Dave on this one, it’s not that I dislike Silva but there are a lot of posts on this site that mention him regardless of the topic. It makes it difficult to discuss Silvas striking ablility when in the post above the guy is talking about how Silva build the log house he was born in… and we all know that only Chuck Noris can do that.
LMAO, no one can touch chuck, they’d burn!
Dave, why would it be good for silva to loose? he doesn’t need to be brought down to earth, he already lost in the past and he doesn’t think he’s invincible. he’ll loose one day again, just not anytime soon (unless he goes against chuck norris LOL).
I’m a big James Irvin fan after seeing the knee that ko’d Terry Martin. I hope to see him KO Silva!
How’d you like the first two rounds of that fight?
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
I am still waiting to see Anderson Silva take a BIG punch in the UFC. Irvin can definitely hit hard, its just a matter of can he “touch” Silva.
also, the spider has never been KO’ed!
Thanks, so we can’t post our own opinions? I think the people above think anderson has been on a bigger streak lately, so he deserves the spot, I don’t think anyone dissed gsp. What a fan of anderson you were, seeing his name made you not a fan?=LAME
oh and thats my opinion, so its just as valid as yours, if we are gonna play the whole “opinion” card
but there is a difference dave, ‘your’ opinion suggests we should censor mentioning other fighters in different threads, while ‘our’ opinion is that no censuring should occur.
WHAT!!!! Yo..it is what it is…It’s total BS. 1. GsP shouldn’t be the only MMA fighter on this list. 2. Anderson Silva is without any debate the best MMA fighter this year. If you ” a fan of Silva ” ..these post would not jump ship. You are not a fan of his. You want Irvin to Ko Silva..that’s ridiculious. Silva is the truth..the truth hurts!!! These thread are put up so us readers can write/say whatever we want about the topic.
and im saying i want to see anderson silva knocked out, simply cause i hate dynastys, thats it man, i like parody, especially in mma
I’d also like to add Penn and GSP… Possibly that would keep everyone from trying to set up these stupid “super” fights between weight classes.
MMA has never seen a fighter like Anderson Silva eve!!..I hope he rains supreme longer then Rampage’s dynasty. You have your opinion..I’ll agree to disagree with you. I was totally shocked to hear..you were a fan of his..but because we give the man his props..you want him to lose. He isn’t even a cocky dude. whatever man. The only fighter that will be dreaming on UFN july19th card..is Irvin. Anderson will drug him up at 205. Like WOAH!!!
I’d also like to add Penn and GSP to this list. Hopefully that would stop the “super” fight fans who don’t care about weight classes and just want to see a three way with Silva, Penn and GSP; winner take all…
The “cockyness” is not on the part of the fighter, Silva seems like a great guy, it’s the bloggers who constantly bring Silva into every from of communication.
PhilQNY, dave is not and never was a fan of the spider, he’s a poser. no fan would become non-fans just because they hear about them constantly in MMA forums, that just doesn’t happen.
Linx: I know man..but this thread..in a way ticks me off a bit..especially with such comments. ( breathe )
I hear you man, me too!
Anderson Silva is the baddest man walking the planet (period).
Truth!!!
I will agree. Only because Fedor is not Human!
How can this dude Dave hate on Anderson Silva? He is the most proffessional and Humble champion EVER! Can u imagine if Silva had a personality like Matt Hughes? he would be the biggest a-hole EVER!
I think I will cry the day I see Silva loose. He is just too great for the sport!
what about BJ Penn
BJ can have a good arguement..but the crown belongs to Silva.
BJ Penn, Anderson Silva and GSP should all be nominated!!!
I totally agree.
Rampage should be nominated. He is only the 1st ever Unified Pride/UFC champion!
Silva is the only other Unified chAMPION. tHAT MEANS A LOT IN MY BOOK!
I agree with you. I am just saying last time I checked BJ speaks english and has defended his title. I think he should be in front of GSP. Silva, Penn, GSP