I would say “untested” (steroids) and not so much overhyped. Having said that he won’t lose his next time out, especially if it’s against Tito.

If we see a flabby Shogun like we saw against Griffin, Tito will kick his asz, if he comes with the agression he had in Pride, he’ll beat anyone, signature fade and white speedos would be nice, he looks like a killer that way.

Liddell vs. Griffin for the 205 pound belt in December 2008!

[quote comment="266886"]Liddell vs. Griffin for the 205 pound belt in December 2008![/quote]

Shame that Rampage will kick BOTH their asses

[quote comment="266886"]Liddell vs. Griffin for the 205 pound belt in December 2008![/quote]

Liddell will for sure need to get IMO to more fights with to tier fighters to get that shot…and Griffin may not get passed Rampage..he has a shot..but I wouldn’t call out this match up just yet.

LOL@red…… How is forrest going to fight liddell for any belt when hes getting knocked out against rampage and disppearing from the top 10…..

Shogun vs chuck hopefully will be there next fight, it will prove if shogun really is the shit or his style is murdered in the ufc.

[quote comment="266885"]If we see a flabby Shogun like we saw against Griffin, Tito will kick his asz, if he comes with the agression he had in Pride, he’ll beat anyone, signature fade and white speedos would be nice, he looks like a killer that way.[/quote]

Who cares about his killer speedos?

Quinton should beat forrest… but you never know. I hear Rampage has a lot of crap going on… something about another reality show after TUF7. I hope not. Concentrate on fighting!

overhyped and under-juiced

[quote comment="266907"][quote comment="266885"]If we see a flabby Shogun like we saw against Griffin, Tito will kick his asz, if he comes with the agression he had in Pride, he’ll beat anyone, signature fade and white speedos would be nice, he looks like a killer that way.[/quote]

Who cares about his killer speedos?[/quote]

yeah what a comment

Shogun should cut the weight and drop to MW, spice it up.

“Liddell vs. Griffin for the 205 pound belt in December 2008!”
That’s probably what the UFC wants. If there is someone that the UFC will publicized as much as they did with Chuck that would be Forrest, that’s a money maker for the UFC. …but of course Rampage can always ruin their plan.

I hate to see Griffen lose this one, so I’ll be pulling for him against Page.

[quote comment="266950"]Shogun should cut the weight and drop to MW, spice it up.[/quote]

I reckon Anderson would have him standing. Shogun would take it to the ground. On the ground I don’t know. It would be interesting.

don’t worry forrest, he’ll be back at 100% so he can first shut you up by beating someone like jardine or tito, that would be enough time for you to have lost your title shot and get a rematch with shogun, where you’ll lose you’re second fight in a roll.

Dana has been waiting for the chance (excuse) to move Forrest to #1 contender. I don’t think he deserves to be there, given his own comments on Shogun and his loss to Jardine.
Forrest’s win over Rua was dominant compared to Jardine’s win over the former champ Liddell, but I for one think Jardine was more deserving than Forrest to be the #1 contender.
Seems Dana and company are more interested in jokes on TUF and degrees of marketability than on pure performance.

Forrest is going with the Rocky 1 attire. At the end of the fight Rampage will be like “there ain’t gonna be no rematch” and Forrest will go “Don’t want none.”

Seriously though, I’m not going to write Forrest off again but I still got to go with QRJ.

Forrest looks like he was in children of the corn

[quote comment="266976"]Dana has been waiting for the chance (excuse) to move Forrest to #1 contender. I don’t think he deserves to be there, given his own comments on Shogun and his loss to Jardine.
Forrest’s win over Rua was dominant compared to Jardine’s win over the former champ Liddell, but I for one think Jardine was more deserving than Forrest to be the #1 contender.
Seems Dana and company are more interested in jokes on TUF and degrees of marketability than on pure performance.[/quote]

Even though Jardine is a TUF alum as well, he definitely isn’t as marketable as Griffin. I would aggree that Griffin is not deserving of a title shot. The problem…neither are any of the other LHWs. If I were casting a vote for the #1 contender, I would probably cast my vote for Machida, who looked awesome in his complete destruction of Soko. But I would say that even Machida needs another fight against top competition. I’m excited about Thiago Silva too, but he’s got a ways to go.

The light heavies are a weird weight class. They’ve got plenty of depth, but they keep beating each other. No one is separating themselves from the rest of the pack.

Shogun is hurt by the UFC rules. The whole Chute Box Academy, especially Shogun, really utilized the kicking and kneeing on the ground heavily. Without it he needs to rethink his strategy or he will lose.

Forrest Griffin is a great marketing tool for the UFC. Since he’s identifiable with the main fan-base of the UFC (18-34, White Male demographic), it would be a financial windfall for Dana (and the UFC) to see Forrest win.

[quote comment="266885"]If we see a flabby Shogun like we saw against Griffin, Tito will kick his asz, if he comes with the agression he had in Pride, he’ll beat anyone, signature fade and white speedos would be nice, he looks like a killer that way.[/quote]

Your a little weird thinking about shogun in speedos

[quote comment="266976"]Dana has been waiting for the chance (excuse) to move Forrest to #1 contender. I don’t think he deserves to be there, given his own comments on Shogun and his loss to Jardine.
Forrest’s win over Rua was dominant compared to Jardine’s win over the former champ Liddell, but I for one think Jardine was more deserving than Forrest to be the #1 contender.
Seems Dana and company are more interested in jokes on TUF and degrees of marketability than on pure performance.[/quote]

Jardine is not more deserving, They where both on the same TUF show and Forrest won it. And Forrest didn’t lose to a new comer in Houston, and he exposed Shogun. Jardine is good but not more deserving than Forrest.

[quote comment="266886"]Liddell vs. Griffin for the 205 pound belt in December 2008![/quote]

I don’t think so buddy.

When Rampage said he will remain champion for a long time,he did not mean 1 or 2 tittle defenses.He’s talking about 4 or 5.

So Forrest isn’t overhyped? Forrest has lost to Tito and Jardine and he was in top shape. Shogun lost to Coleman because of a broken arm and forrest with a torn ACL. I used to think Forrest was a gamer and wouldn’t disrespect fighters like that. Show me any of Forrests wins vs. Shoguns and tell me who the better fighter is. Forrests wins are against guys like Hector Ramirez, Elvis Sinosic, and Stephen Bonnar. Shogun has beaten Nogueira, Randleman, Rampage, and Overeem to name a few. When you get a little more competition Forrest maybe you can talk trash until then, enjoy the ass kicking you’re gonna get from Quinton.

[quote comment="267052"][quote comment="266976"]Dana has been waiting for the chance (excuse) to move Forrest to #1 contender. I don’t think he deserves to be there, given his own comments on Shogun and his loss to Jardine.
Forrest’s win over Rua was dominant compared to Jardine’s win over the former champ Liddell, but I for one think Jardine was more deserving than Forrest to be the #1 contender.
Seems Dana and company are more interested in jokes on TUF and degrees of marketability than on pure performance.[/quote]

Jardine is not more deserving, They where both on the same TUF show and Forrest won it. And Forrest didn’t lose to a new comer in Houston, and he exposed Shogun. Jardine is good but not more deserving than Forrest.[/quote]

Aren’t you forgetting that Jardine KO’d Forrest?

Sho needs to work on the 2 things top fighters in America almost always do better than their counterparts in Japan – conditioning and wrestling. If he is successful with that, he will work himself up the food chain in no time.

Oh and Tito is gonna get smacked around like a whore with an attitude. Seriously, keep this guy out of the UFC already.

Rampage is an outstanding fighter (I think he’s an ass though), but styles make fights. He’s beat Liddell twice, but Liddell beat Wanderlei, who’s KO’d Rampage, twice! My point is that Griffin may have the style that brings Rampage down. Personally, I would love it if he could make Rampage cry like a little girl. Not gonna happen, but I’d enjoy it.

Shogun definately took that first fight lightly, especially after dominating in Pride. I also agree that he was a bit flabby and was not in shape – I was shocked when I saw him for the first time.

He wont loose his next fight.

[quote post="4532"]don’t worry forrest, he’ll be back at 100% so he can first shut you up by beating someone like jardine or tito, that would be enough time for you to have lost your title shot and get a rematch with shogun, where you’ll lose you’re second fight in a roll.[/quote]
Forrest was injured going into that fight also. He had shoulder surgery recently.

[quote comment="267104"][quote comment="267052"][quote comment="266976"]Dana has been waiting for the chance (excuse) to move Forrest to #1 contender. I don’t think he deserves to be there, given his own comments on Shogun and his loss to Jardine.
Forrest’s win over Rua was dominant compared to Jardine’s win over the former champ Liddell, but I for one think Jardine was more deserving than Forrest to be the #1 contender.
Seems Dana and company are more interested in jokes on TUF and degrees of marketability than on pure performance.[/quote]

Jardine is not more deserving, They where both on the same TUF show and Forrest won it. And Forrest didn’t lose to a new comer in Houston, and he exposed Shogun. Jardine is good but not more deserving than Forrest.[/quote]

Aren’t you forgetting that Jardine KO’d Forrest?[/quote]
Doesn’t matter , Jardine only won ONE fight after getting owned. He has to win at least one more before a title shot.

Jardine doesnt deserve shit…..Forrest deserves the title fight because the beat the #1 ranked LHW at the time. Also for those idiots who say forrest dominated the fight or exposed shogun….LOL Shogun whooped forrest ass the 1st round and 3minutes into round 2 was gased otherwise he wouldve continued whooping forrest ass. At the start of the 3rd round he was 100%out of fuel and forrest took him out, maybe you didnt see forrest face after the fight….it was alot worse then shoguns but its this simple he DIDNT train enough and didnt take the |||punching bag||| seriously.

I think you guys should save your comments until we see a relaxed / uninjured Shogun…

for a knee injury, org change, rule change, impending camp change, he didn’t do that bad, the injury’s forced limitations are obvious when you watch the fight…and this is only one loss…

for all the “hyping” of Shogun to my lesser MMA educated friends…For my sake I sure hope you all eat your words the next time around…

*He did fight at least once in the USA under Pride with negative test results…and looked like a beast…although injury free he was not letting Overeems early advantage due to his superior size get to him

Edit – insert UFC debut above

[quote comment="267302"]
*He did fight at least once in the USA under Pride with negative test results…and looked like a beast…although injury free he was not letting Overeems early advantage due to his superior size get to him[/quote]

That fight was indeed amazing, but man.. Overeem was tossing Sho around like a ragdoll in the beginning. Shogun was relentless though. The outcome almost seemed inevitable the way he kept coming at him lol. The setup and the fight-ending punch in that one is one of my favorite MMA moments.

[quote comment="266976"]Dana has been waiting for the chance (excuse) to move Forrest to #1 contender. I don’t think he deserves to be there, given his own comments on Shogun and his loss to Jardine.
Forrest’s win over Rua was dominant compared to Jardine’s win over the former champ Liddell, but I for one think Jardine was more deserving than Forrest to be the #1 contender.
Seems Dana and company are more interested in jokes on TUF and degrees of marketability than on pure performance.[/quote]
GREAT POINT EVERYBODYS KNOWS WHO DANAS BOYS ARE WHY ISNT IT THE DEAN OF MEAN VS RAMPAGE OR DEAN OF MEAN VS WANDERLEI WE KNOW WHO THE FAVORITES ARE ITS NOT FAIR

Tito is a bad fight for Shogun imo. UFC rules favor wrestlers and like Forrest Tito is much bigger than him

nice vid
i didnt know he has shoulder problems. anyways, when the jackson fight rolls around. i see jackson taking it.

[quote comment="267354"][quote comment="267302"]
*He did fight at least once in the USA under Pride with negative test results…and looked like a beast…although injury free he was not letting Overeems early advantage due to his superior size get to him[/quote]

That fight was indeed amazing, but man.. Overeem was tossing Sho around like a ragdoll in the beginning. Shogun was relentless though. The outcome almost seemed inevitable the way he kept coming at him lol. The setup and the fight-ending punch in that one is one of my favorite MMA moments.[/quote]

A sick knockout if ever there was one…If he missed with that he could have broken his hand easily!

[quote comment="267013"]Shogun is hurt by the UFC rules. The whole Chute Box Academy, especially Shogun, really utilized the kicking and kneeing on the ground heavily. Without it he needs to rethink his strategy or he will lose.[/quote]

It will be interesting to see how they gamed Werdum to fight Gonzaga. If Werdum does good against him maybe that will be the way they can go with Chute Box for the UFC.

[quote comment="267092"]So Forrest isn’t overhyped? Forrest has lost to Tito and Jardine and he was in top shape. Shogun lost to Coleman because of a broken arm and forrest with a torn ACL. I used to think Forrest was a gamer and wouldn’t disrespect fighters like that. Show me any of Forrests wins vs. Shoguns and tell me who the better fighter is. Forrests wins are against guys like Hector Ramirez, Elvis Sinosic, and Stephen Bonnar. Shogun has beaten Nogueira, Randleman, Rampage, and Overeem to name a few. When you get a little more competition Forrest maybe you can talk trash until then, enjoy the ass kicking you’re gonna get from Quinton.[/quote]

SpiderStyle: I completely agree with all of your comments. Forrest was a classy guy and I never thought I would have heard him say some dumb stuff like that. We talk about how stupid it is when fighters make excuses for losses, but a tirn ACL is no joke. That is a really serious injury. Shogun could have and should have withdrew from that fight, had surgery and then fought forrest. But instead he chose the Warrior route, and fought any way. Even though he lost, it was a real courageous performance by shogun and in no way did that fight show the real shogun. Shogun will be back better then ever, and after he destroys his next opponent, all the LHW will be crapping there paints again at the thought of fighting him.

[quote comment="266885"]If we see a flabby Shogun like we saw against Griffin, Tito will kick his asz, if he comes with the agression he had in Pride, he’ll beat anyone, signature fade and white speedos would be nice, he looks like a killer that way.[/quote]

lol i can’t stop laughing at this comment

[quote comment="266976"]Dana has been waiting for the chance (excuse) to move Forrest to #1 contender. I don’t think he deserves to be there, given his own comments on Shogun and his loss to Jardine.
Forrest’s win over Rua was dominant compared to Jardine’s win over the former champ Liddell, but I for one think Jardine was more deserving than Forrest to be the #1 contender.
Seems Dana and company are more interested in jokes on TUF and degrees of marketability than on pure performance.[/quote]

Completely agree… the UFC’s prorities are about selling PPV’s, they do this by putting marketable names against each other. They do this at the stake of worthy challengers.

I’ll make this clear, i am a Forrest fan (who isn’t) but one win against a ‘rabbit in the headlights’ shogun does not grant a shot.

Jardine, Machida, Evans and Thiago Silva all deserve to be in-front of Forrest. But if you look at that list there are NO PERSONALITIES which equals no PPV buys.

Another example is the TUF4 situation, to give a reality show winner a straight shot rubs salt in the eyes of the likes of Karo, Fitch and at the time Sanchez. They did it in a hope that the series would be massive (it wasn’t) and the PPV’s were huge (they weren’t).

My last example is Randy coming off two crushing losses to walk straight into a title shot at heavyweight (a weight that he got bullied out of). If it wasn’t Captain America the idea alone would have been laughed out of the board room.

I’m not saying i agree or disagree its just how it is and always will be.

The fact is i think we’ll all prefer to see a Forrest-Rampage over a Jardine but does it make it fair? hell no.

[quote comment="266907"][quote comment="266885"]If we see a flabby Shogun like we saw against Griffin, Tito will kick his asz, if he comes with the agression he had in Pride, he’ll beat anyone, signature fade and white speedos would be nice, he looks like a killer that way.[/quote]

Who cares about his killer speedos?[/quote]

lol !…i guess its like the icemans trademark shorts, AA’s samson hair, Crocops Tuyt pants (like Goldmember would say lol)

Rampage is going to KO Forrest in Rd 1. No disrespect to Forrest, but Rampage is going to hold that belt for another year.

[quote comment="267824"]Rampage is going to KO Forrest in Rd 1. No disrespect to Forrest, but Rampage is going to hold that belt for another year.[/quote]
i tend to think different i feel forrest matches up against rampage better than alot of fighters griffin via decision,and about page holding the belt ….i guess so if he beats forrest that will probably be his only fight….hes only fighting once in 08…prob. december that to me is pathetic!

[quote comment="267774"][quote comment="267092"]So Forrest isn’t overhyped? Forrest has lost to Tito and Jardine and he was in top shape. Shogun lost to Coleman because of a broken arm and forrest with a torn ACL. I used to think Forrest was a gamer and wouldn’t disrespect fighters like that. Show me any of Forrests wins vs. Shoguns and tell me who the better fighter is. Forrests wins are against guys like Hector Ramirez, Elvis Sinosic, and Stephen Bonnar. Shogun has beaten Nogueira, Randleman, Rampage, and Overeem to name a few. When you get a little more competition Forrest maybe you can talk trash until then, enjoy the ass kicking you’re gonna get from Quinton.[/quote]

SpiderStyle: I completely agree with all of your comments. Forrest was a classy guy and I never thought I would have heard him say some dumb stuff like that. We talk about how stupid it is when fighters make excuses for losses, but a tirn ACL is no joke. That is a really serious injury. Shogun could have and should have withdrew from that fight, had surgery and then fought forrest. But instead he chose the Warrior route, and fought any way. Even though he lost, it was a real courageous performance by shogun and in no way did that fight show the real shogun. Shogun will be back better then ever, and after he destroys his next opponent, all the LHW will be crapping there paints again at the thought of fighting him.[/quote]

This is sport of ” what have you done for me lately “..MMA fans have a short memory spand. Shogun is the real deal..Forrest didn’t walk thru Shogun..just out worked him and had better stamina..both came in hurt granted…the outcome is what it is..Forrest should never be taken lighty and can beat one one on any given night. Shogun is still one of the top tier fighters at 205..just look up his record..who he beat and how he beat them..other then losing to Forrest he had early in his career a loss to Babalu and a freak accident to Coleman..Shogun is young..why forrest will go over the top and say if he loses his next fight Shogun is over rated makes no sense to me.

[quote comment="267092"]So Forrest isn’t overhyped? Forrest has lost to Tito and Jardine and he was in top shape. Shogun lost to Coleman because of a broken arm and forrest with a torn ACL. I used to think Forrest was a gamer and wouldn’t disrespect fighters like that. Show me any of Forrests wins vs. Shoguns and tell me who the better fighter is. Forrests wins are against guys like Hector Ramirez, Elvis Sinosic, and Stephen Bonnar. Shogun has beaten Nogueira, Randleman, Rampage, and Overeem to name a few. When you get a little more competition Forrest maybe you can talk trash until then, enjoy the ass kicking you’re gonna get from Quinton.[/quote]

Tito was a close decision that many believe went the wrong way. Jardine is no slouch. So he got caught by a guy (Houston) with knock out power. He also beat Chuck. Who just beat Wandy! Andy was right when he posted that the 205 is a weird class. They do have lots of depth. But many of them are very evenly matched. More overall talent and big names than any other weight class IMO.

You keep making excuses for Shogun. But Forrest had an injury too. Shogun is not new to the fight game. Conditioning is part of it. But if he really was as good as he was hyped, he would have destroyed Forrest in the first round before conditioning became an issue!

Lastly, lay off Forrest. You guys act like he was talking crap to Shogun. I thought he answered the question honestly and respectfully. He didn’t dwell on it. I’m sure all he has heard about is how Wandy and Shogun would come in and dominate the UFC LHW division. Now they both have come in with losses in their UFC debuts. If Shogun has another straight loss, like Cro Cop, he will indeed be overhyped. Plain and simple. Going from a speculated complete, unanswered domination to two straight losses starting out is overhyped. That does not, by the way, diminish Shogun’s amazing (and still young) career. But let’s call a spade a spade. Thus far, Shogun has been overhyped. At least Griffin had the respect to basically say, let’s wait and see: give the guy another shot first.

If anything, Griffin has been underhyped. He has always been dubbed as a fan favorite but not a serious contender. No real MMA aficionado picked Forrest over Shogun. And with the constant upsets and back and forth in LHW, there is no clear cut #1 contender. Machida and Silva still need more UFC fights under their belt. You could make a serious case for Jardine, but Forrest’s destruction of Shogun clinched the deal.

Rampage will knockout Forrest the same way Jardine knocked him out. I like Forrest he’s a great guy and fighter, but he won against Shogun not because he was fighting that good, but because Shogun was fighting that bad. I have not really seen much of Shogun, but he looked like Elvis Sinosic could have beaten him that night. I don’t think it will get past the second round. I also think Machida should have been fighting Jardine next after his immpressive win, but as far as the UFC is concerned Jardine does not have the look or the personality they want, they are not concerned with his skill in the octogan, and will probably make him pay for beating there money maker Liddell.

Exact Forrest quote: ” I thought he would be pretty good , and he was. If he loses his next fight , or doesn’t look too great in his next fight, then yeah he was overhyped. If not, he just had a bad night”

Wow! I never knew Griffin was such a sh!t talker! (sarcasm intended).

[quote comment="267920"]Exact Forrest quote: ” I thought he would be pretty good , and he was. If he loses his next fight , or doesn’t look too great in his next fight, then yeah he was overhyped. If not, he just had a bad night”

Wow! I never knew Griffin was such a sh!t talker! (sarcasm intended).[/quote]

Exactly. How some of you turned what Griffin said into shit-talking amazes me. The reporter specifically asked Forrest if Shogun was over-hyped and that was his response. Nothing disrespectful there, imo.

Forrest Griffin does not deserve a title shot. He should be facing Jardine. Jardine is more deserving than Griffin. In my opinion, I believe the only reason Griffin is fighting for the title is because he actually fought and barely beat Shogun. All you fwho say Shogun is overhyped should realize that if it weren’t for him, Griffin would not by in the title fight. The UFC obviously knows that Shogun was top of the class to actually allow Griffin face Rampage after his victory. Let Griffin get his 15 minutes of fame, after the fight against Rampage, that will be the beginning of the end for him. You’ll then see who is overhyped.

is the Freddy Kreuger hat really necessary? come one man who do u think u r?

[quote comment="268165"]Forrest Griffin does not deserve a title shot. He should be facing Jardine. Jardine is more deserving than Griffin. In my opinion, I believe the only reason Griffin is fighting for the title is because he actually fought and barely beat Shogun. All you fwho say Shogun is overhyped should realize that if it weren’t for him, Griffin would not by in the title fight. The UFC obviously knows that Shogun was top of the class to actually allow Griffin face Rampage after his victory. Let Griffin get his 15 minutes of fame, after the fight against Rampage, that will be the beginning of the end for him. You’ll then see who is overhyped.[/quote]

I agree with with Griffin being over hyped but you can not seriously believe that he “barely” beat shogun. he domniated shogun the whole fight. He definitly deservs a title shot after that. I dont know if you’ve been in a cave, but shogun KO’d rampage and the fact that griffin not only beat shogun but finished it with a choke definitly gives him a chance to fight for the title. Who do you think shogun was going to fight after forrest?!?!
Again i still think he is overhyped and he is not as good as DANA WHITE thinks he is, but 100% he deserves a title shot.

one more thing….you want to see a fight where someone “barely” wins??…….jardine vs the iceman

[quote comment="267162"]Rampage is an outstanding fighter (I think he’s an ass though), but styles make fights. He’s beat Liddell twice, but Liddell beat Wanderlei, who’s KO’d Rampage, twice! My point is that Griffin may have the style that brings Rampage down. Personally, I would love it if he could make Rampage cry like a little girl. Not gonna happen, but I’d enjoy it.[/quote]

I don’t want to make any excuses, but it seems that most of the ex-Pride fighters aren’t fighting at their best in the UFC, take a look at Wanderlei’s older fights, his nickname is mad dog, and he definitely didn’t show that during his fight against Liddell. Look at his Pride fights on the other hand, he always looks as if his out to kill his opponent.

Mirko and shogun as well, they look completely different from when they were in Pride.

I can’t be the only one who has noticed these things, anyone whose seen them fight should be able to see it.