In the opening seconds of the UFC 76: “Knockout” pay-per-view (PPV) telecast ringside announcer Mike Goldberg confirmed that Chuck Liddell would face Wanderlei Silva on December 29 with a win over Keith Jardine in the main event.
“Iceman” went on to drop a split-decision to the “Dean of Mean,” dashing the monster showdown for which fans have clamored for years once again.
UFC President Dana White seemed resigned to the fact that the biggest fight in mixed martial arts history just one year ago was perhaps “never meant to happen, according to FOXSports.com.
Here’s a snip from White:
“‘It’s just not meant to happen,’ said White, who talked about a conversation with Silva as the fight was going on, and telling Silva that he thought Jardine was going to win the fight. He noted Silva was in complete denial, seeing huge dollar signs fly out the window.”
That’s not even the half of it. In fact, there is an article on Yahoo!Sports.com that mentions Liddell is contemplating hanging up the gloves after his second consecutive loss — the first time that has happened in the illustrious career of the 37-year-old.
Here’s a snip from White in that article:
“There’s a hunger thing that you have to have to be an elite fighter and I just didn’t see a Chuck Liddell who was as hungry as he used to be. Chuck has made a lot of money in this business and he’s done a lot of things, but he wasn’t the Chuck of old…. He needs to do what’s right for him and not worry about us. This isn’t the kind of sport you can be in half-heartedly. If you don’t have the passion for it, it’s time to get out. Only Chuck really knows how he feels, but you wonder because he hasn’t looked the same, fire-wise, in either of these last two fights.”
Agreed.
All the retirement talk, however, seems to be a bit premature — we’re talking about a conversation in a locker room immediately following another disappointing loss. Put simply, this is a major life decision that is perhaps not best determined under the circumstances.
In addition, there is no question that Liddell-Silva is going to sell crazy tickets and monster PPV’s. It’s probably no longer a headliner, but it will still help fill the till to the brim.
And let’s not forget: Silva is also on a two-fight losing skid. He, too, is not getting any younger, either.
Finally, is there another fighter on this planet who Liddell would “get up” more for than “The Axe Murderer?” I don’t think so. Provided Liddell decides to not retire, then the clash with Silva makes sense .. and cents.
December 29 is now or never.
81 Comments »
Definately would be a great fight but at this point the thread is right…. it cant be a headlining fight. But obviously that card would be so stacked if it was right under the main event.
PS. First post.
Chuck needs to set up the right hand with kicks. The one trick pony thing has been exposed .
Chuck should stop looking for that one punch KO, where are his kicks, where is his clinch, I mean if u see you can’t KO a guy, try a different technique, this is MMA, you have to adapt to your opponent. If he is going to fight Wandi like his last two fights, Wandi will whoop his ars to a definite retirement.
Wandi vs Iceman, make it happen, I already bought my plane ticket.
it would still be a major fight
i say chuck wanderlei ASAP
it doesnt matter that both are on 2 fight losing streaks
after the pathetic debut by yet another pride fighter by shogun its not a good idea to put on a warm up fight for the against a TUF opponent… feed them to chuck straight away
by beating chuck and forrest jardine probably deserves a title shot… if only he hadnt fought houston hed probably be next in line
the 205 division is a bit of a mess atm
its very unclear who the true #1 contender is
they need to introduce some scoring system to clean up the mess
i dont know if dan henderson wants to stay at LHW but hes definitely top 5
id put henderson and jackson up against forest and jardine… either split would be interesting
I diagree with White that Chuck doesn’t have the hunger. When was the last time you saw Chuck press the action like he did in the first round with Jardine. Usually he sits back to counter. I’m not saying he dominated the fight by any means, but he was an agressor, more so than the “usual” Chuck.
It is a fight that should go on neither fighter is at the top of their game right now. But it would make for a really exciting fight under the headliner.
At this point I don’t really care about Liddell-Silva anymore. If they make that fight it should be called UFC 78 - Has Beens.
In this sport if one thing ain’t working for you..go to something else..Chuck can’t or won’t do that..I like many would love to see Wandi vs Chuck..but what is in Chuck’s head.??? We just have to wait and see what happens.
Jardine vs Wandi
Machida vs Forrest ( or vice versa )
the winner faces each other for the title shot against Page.
the loser faces Alexander.
Its not a title fight, its not a headliner, but it is a fight that i would still love to see. Chuck beats Wandi, outstanding, the good old Iceman’s still got some fight in him. Wandi beats Chuck, let him go ahead and fight rampage. He’s already beaten him before, Chuck can be his warm up fight. Either way, it would be a fun undercard fight to watch.
Its sad! Here in the UFC we tend to only want to see the fighters that have the momenum on their side! I am guilty as well, beacause this fight does not appeal to me right now! I would like to see Wandi vs Houston! Winner gets title shot! But that is just me! and I am deffinately not saying this is right! I guess I believe Chuck is faling of the top. Just like so many champions who stay in there just a little to long and start getting beat is this what is happening to him?
I dont know but he had a good run, I think it is time for him to consider retiring! This fight will not be what it was supposed to be! In their prime these fighters would have given a great war for us, but let’s face it neither of them or there now!
I don’t know maybe Chuck wanted to loose a split a decision, at least now if Chuck faces Wandi they both coming from 2 loses, I think from a promoting side, its better to have two big figthers have the same jump start, otherwise Silva should not even deserve to fight Chuck if Chuck would have killed Jardine.
Jardine is one ungly looking Orc, I don’t know how you market a guy after he got killed by Assassin. All props to Forrest though, Forrest deserves need to fight Machinda for a tittle shot.
I agree with Mania…I don’t care if Chuck lost. Silva doesn’t have the title. It’s not like they would be giving him a title shot coming off a loss. Assuming he doesn’t retire, they really need to make this fight happen. Why the hell not?
[quote comment=”157399″]I diagree with White that Chuck doesn’t have the hunger. When was the last time you saw Chuck press the action like he did in the first round with Jardine. Usually he sits back to counter. I’m not saying he dominated the fight by any means, but he was an agressor, more so than the “usual” Chuck.[/quote]
I think him being to aggressive and getting off first was his biggest problem. Everytime he got off first and missed, he got nailed by a big right hand or he got nailed by a big kick. He should have been a counter puncher like he normally is. Also he needs to quit thinking he is going to knock everybody out in the first round. To me he looked pretty gassed after the first. And why didn’t Chuck answer Jardine’s leg and side kicks with some of his own!?
It’s not accurate to compare Chuck’s situation with Wand’s. Yes, they’ve both lost 2 fights in a row, but Wand is 31. There’s no reason to think Wand can’t come back with a vengeance. Chuck is almost 38. With the exception of Randy, most 38-year-olds (and older) don’t do well in this sport. We can point out Royce, Saku, Coleman, Pat Miletich, and Mo Smith among the many examples. Chuck has had recent knee injuries, and frankly, Dana is right that Chuck doesn’t appear hungry anymore. Wand is starting his own team and seems eager to fight again despite his 2 losses.
[quote post=”3414″]Jardine vs Wandi
Machida vs Forrest ( or vice versa )
the winner faces each other for the title shot against Page.
the loser faces Alexander. [/quote]
I like that idea but you cant really put Jardine against Houston again as a battle for the #1 contender spot if Jardine won against wandi. If Jardine beat Wandi you would have to just let Houston get a title shot and then have Jardine next in line maybe.
Whatever the case be….. the 205 is a little messy right now.
[quote comment=”157429″]It’s not accurate to compare Chuck’s situation with Wand’s. Yes, they’ve both lost 2 fights in a row, but Wand is 31. There’s no reason to think Wand can’t come back with a vengeance. Chuck is almost 38. With the exception of Randy, most 38-year-olds (and older) don’t do well in this sport. We can point out Royce, Saku, Coleman, Pat Miletich, and Mo Smith among the many examples. Chuck has had recent knee injuries, and frankly, Dana is right that Chuck doesn’t appear hungry anymore. Wand is starting his own team and seems eager to fight again despite his 2 losses.[/quote]
Let’s also not forget that 1 of Wand’s losses was during the Open Weight Grand Prix where he fought at HW & lost to Cro Cop via vicious Head Kick.
(Circumstance should never be overlooked.)
Let’s not Forget Couture was beat into retirement and came back better than ever maybe a good kick in the @ss is what Chuck needed.
I don’t think that Chuck didn’t train hard, his beer gut wasn’t as large as usual, however I agree that he didn’t have the heart. I think Dana is questioning his heart and that’s what’s needed to provide good fights. We thought this fight was crap when they first scheduled it but boy were we wrong and it turned out to be a good fight and an upset. Dana seems to know what he’s doing and where the different fighters are at.
We should see Chuck vs Silva in Dec headlined by Rampage fighting Griffin or someone else for a title fight.
Retirement for UFC fighters like Chuck is a 18-24 month lay off, sign a HUGE fight to come back like Randy, and come back.
But yeah, there wasnt any fire with Chuck…
December already got a headline fight, Serra fights Hughes, Hello, but it needs a second great fight to sell this PPV, which would be Silva vs Chuck.
The Iceman cometh,the Iceman goeth, Chuck is done just like Crocop.
RAMPAGE will reign supreme forever.
At this point in his career, it’s too late for Chuck to overhaul his game, but he could add new wrinkles. I think he should work on a clinch game and also a ground-and-pound game. I think he has the tools to do both, but he just can’t be stubborn about it. We’ll never see Chuck triangle a guy, but at least try to take a guy down from the clinch and then pound on him.
My take on Chuck is, its not that he isn’t hungry, it’s that his world has evolved around him and he resists change. His strategy is lame. He can’t just knock people out because he is Chuck Liddell anymore. Rampage proved that he can be knocked out and that he has poor punch defense which apparently Chuck doesn’t want to fix.
Chuck never struck me as an “intelligent” fighter, he is just a guy who hits hard and seemingly is a guy you could have a beer with.
I think Lidell fought a good fight, however he didn’t follow up to get the KO, it seems a little afraid to get caught as it happened with Jackson, and that is normal. Silva Vs Lidell, has to happen, maybe shouldn’t be the next fight, let Lidell get one great victory then put him against Silva.
Lidell still one of the greatest fighters in the world, he’ll be back, we can’t count him out because of this fight.
I dont understand how so many people are convinced that Houston Alexander is on the top of the heap. He got lucky and caught Jardine and beat a bottom tier fighter in Sakara. I want to see him beat one of the top contenders before we even talk about him getting a title shot.
I do agree with the whole Forrest vs. Machida and Jardine vs. Silva idea. Yes, Chuck vs. Silva may get more attention, but this is supposed to be a sport and we are supposed to be trying to find out who is the best.
I say put Chuck against Alexander.
FORREST VS WANDERLEI (possibly for title shot)
This is the fight that should happen in December. If Forrest can beat both Chute Boxe boys it makes a great story for a future title shot at Rampage if he keeps the belt, as it would mean Forrest Griffin would of handed losses out to the two guys who gave Rampage his most brutal losses.
On the other hand Wanderlei will want to avenge Shoguns loss and this will give time for Chuck to have have one last attempt by fighting another strong fighter and if he wins then the Wand Vs Liddell wil be back on or the title.
With the Shogun/Liddell upset not as many title contenders as before who will be the Rampages next opponenet?
[quote comment=”157434″][quote post=”3414″]Jardine vs Wandi
Machida vs Forrest ( or vice versa )
the winner faces each other for the title shot against Page.
the loser faces Alexander. [/quote]
I like that idea but you cant really put Jardine against Houston again as a battle for the #1 contender spot if Jardine won against wandi. If Jardine beat Wandi you would have to just let Houston get a title shot and then have Jardine next in line maybe.
Whatever the case be….. the 205 is a little messy right now.[/quote]
..lets say Jardine beats Wandi. he is in the semis
lets say Forrest beats Machida. he is in the semis
Jardine vs Forrest..for the title shot.
Wandi vs Machida..winner gets Alexander..and then goes from there.
I would like to see.. Shogun vs Dan Henderson..they arer both coming off loses..and should of fought in pride already.
[quote post=”3414″]I don’t know maybe Chuck wanted to loose a split a decision, at least now if Chuck faces Wandi they both coming from 2 loses, I think from a promoting side, its better to have two big figthers have the same jump start, otherwise Silva should not even deserve to fight Chuck if Chuck would have killed Jardine.
Jardine is one ungly looking Orc, I don’t know how you market a guy after he got killed by Assassin. All props to Forrest though, Forrest deserves need to fight Machinda for a tittle shot. [/quote]
You are saying that Chuck was training to lose? So that means that Chuck performed EXACTLY how he wanted to on Saturday since he lost a split decision? WHY would he want that? To my knowledge, Chuck wants 2 things right now:
1) To get his career back on track, and headed for a title shot.
2) To fight Wanderlei Silva.
In order for him to accomplish EITHER of those two goals, it was said that Chuck needs to beat Jardine.
You also say that the fight is more marketable now that Chuck lost 2 staight fights?? If you perfer to see losing fighters fight, tune into BoDog. Win or lose in the Jardine match, the Chuck/Wandi fight can still be marketed as “the two most dominant champs in the history of the 205lb division will clash” A loss is never good for a fighter from a marketing standpoint. It just makes zero sense. You also say that Wandi wouldn’t have derserved to fight Chuck if he beat Jardine, LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. Do you know who Wanderlei Silva is? Do you know that both, Chuck and Wandi have wanted to fight each other for about 4 years? I would actually say that if Chuck couldn’t KO Jardine, than Chuck doesn’t deserve to fight Wandi. But the truth of the matter is that these 2 fighters MORE than deserve to fight each other. Wandi’s losses were to a HW Cro Cop who was then at the top of his game, and his second was to MW and LHW champ Dan Henderson. Wandi was also very sick, and actually hospitalized the day before the fight. 99.999% of the fighters in MMA would NOT have still fought Henderson that night, but this is Wanderlei Silva and he is a true warrior.
Machida does not deserve to be in a #1 contender fight. Actually, he doesn’t even deserve to fight ANYONE in the UFC Top 10. What has he done in the UFC besides pull off a couple of decsions that are so boring, that most of them go from supposed to be televised, to not being televised. Also, Decision wins over Sam Hoger, David Heath, and Nakamura do not get you a #1 contender match! If beating 3 bums gets you a title shot, Bisping would have lost 2 championship bouts already!
Just let them fight already!!! If they’re both on the way out I WANNA SEE THEM FIGHT.
Houston Alexander needs to fight Tito next. I want to see his cardio and ground game tested before even thinking of a title shot.
Liddell/Silva does not need to be the main event. It would be a perfect featured bout for December’s card with the main event being Hughes/Serra. Geez, I never thought I’d say that. Out of Chuck Liddell, Wanderlei Silva, and Matt Serra - who would be headlining the main event of the year end event. Prior to GSP/Serra, I would have admitted myself to an insane asylum. But that is the world of MMA - unpredictable.
I don’t think that Chuck needs to retire. I think he just needs to take some time off. After his loss to Rampage, he was back in the gym just days later. After this second loss, I think he should take it easy, spend some time with his family, and find out if there’s anything else out there that makes him happy, other than fighting. Because right now, his fights can’t be making him too happy. Chuck is a professional fighter. Most pro athletes that retire at a rather young age - not due to injury, end up coming back to the sport they love. Chuck should spend 1 month out of the gym to rethink everything. If he decides that he needs to get back into the octagon, then great. Start training like you’ve never trained before so he can fight his dream fight against the Axe Murder.
It would be a shame if Liddell/Silva NEVER happens because of Keith Jardine. I never considered myself a BIG fan of Jardine, but if this is the case - I’ll hate him forever!!!!
[quote comment=”157472″]Houston Alexander needs to fight Tito next. I want to see his cardio and ground game tested before even thinking of a title shot.[/quote]
And if he ends up crushing Tito like he did the other two, great, then everyone wins!!
Question for UFCMania…sorry its off topic but I’ve read rumors that Shogun may possibly have a cerebral hematoma. Have you heard anything about this? It could also easily be someone making something up.
This is where I saw it first…http://www.sherdog.net/forums/showthread.php?t=648551
If Chuck keeps fighting the way he did against Jardine with nothing in his offensive arsenal besides punches, he is gonna get beat up again and there is no telling by whom.
I assure you, Wandy will be a scrub like the rest. You think Shogun was bad, wait till you see Wandy in December. After what I saw on Saturday, from Shogun, I am completely disgusted. Place your bets on when Wandy will puke from exhaustion, I say mid-way through the 2nd. Liddell or not, it doesn’t matter.
Fedor’s the smart one, now we know why he hasn’t signed. Dude knows better.
Hey UFC fighters, hurry up and pull a Forrest now!! Say you want Wandy in December and beat a big name. It will shoot you up the ladder and you got nothing to lose if he’s the big favorite. This deal won’t be around much longer!!!
worst demonstration I’ve ever seen from Shogun in my life…rolling around on the floor for 3 rounds like a little school girl. If this is the Matrix, someone definitely removed the MMA program from his brain.
To beat Chuck:
1.don’t get caught with his hands.
2.weather his short storms.
Jardine performed this flawlessly in turn making Chuck look like a chump. Chuck is at the same difficulty level he’s been at for years.
I think Chucks’s more frustrated about his timeless flawless game plan failing.
[quote post=”3414″]Machida does not deserve to be in a #1 contender fight. Actually, he doesn’t even deserve to fight ANYONE in the UFC Top 10. What has he done in the UFC besides pull off a couple of decsions that are so boring, that most of them go from supposed to be televised, to not being televised. Also, Decision wins over Sam Hoger, David Heath, and Nakamura do not get you a #1 contender match![/quote]
I see what you’re saying, but I would like to see him fight a well known fighter. I’m not sure if Houston Alexander would be considered top 10, but a match against Machida would be a good one.
Chuck needs a new camp. That is it. He still has speed, power and he can take a punch. Look at Jarine’s post fight interview out there on the web - jardine is hurting today. I say we send him to Hawaii to train with Leben.
Peace
[quote comment=”157474″][quote comment=”157472″]Houston Alexander needs to fight Tito next. I want to see his cardio and ground game tested before even thinking of a title shot.[/quote]
And if he ends up crushing Tito like he did the other two, great, then everyone wins!![/quote]
Was thinking this the other day, however, what happens if Rashad wins (again) ?
I honestly would like to see Alexander fight the American Pysco. Stephen can fight from a distance and I dont think he has been knocked out. I believe many have counted him out too quickly. I think with Jardine’s and Griffin’s recent victories we might want to revaluate him.
Peace
Peace
[quote comment=”157407″]
Jardine vs Wandi
Machida vs Forrest ( or vice versa )
the winner faces each other for the title shot against Page.
the loser faces Alexander.[/quote]
I wouldn’t look forward to Machida/Forest at all. Machida is a good fighter, but very boring. Id like to see Forest vs. Wandy, or Forest vs. Jardine rematch!! I think 3 out of 4 times Forest wins that fight. He was taking Jardine apart in that round but he was getting careless. If only he made it to the bell, his corner probably would have told him to stop ducking his head.
Also, somebody is going to have to fight Jackson while we are deciding all these top contenders, I think Forest is more deserving than anyone.
As for Alexander, Im not impressed yet, dude can hit hard and fast, but so far the two fights we’ve seen him in nobody has tried anything against him except come right at him!!! Lets put a smart fighter up against him like Machida. If he wins that, I will be impressed.
So many possibilities, but here is what Id like to see:
Forest vs. Jackson ( I think he earned it after schooling Shogun)
Jardine vs. Wandy (winner fights the winner of Forest & Jackson, could end up as an awesome rematch!!)
Alexander vs. Machida or Henderson (I think Alexander will be exposed in either of these fight)
Here are my desired matchups:
1. Alexander vs. Machida for a title shot
2. Griffin vs. Jardine 2 for the next in line, no.2 contender or just for the hell of it, it’s a rematch I’d be interested in (Hopefully Forrest puts him away).
As for Chuck I wouldn’t mind if he retired, I’d prefer that than have to see him lose again to a fighter he would have put away in his prime. (I’m talking the likes of Jardine not ‘Page; Quinton’s the man and has Chucky’s number).
So screw Chute Boxe relations. Pay Shogun and Wandy what Chuck Wandy were supposed to earn. A battle of former pride boys.
3. Shogun vs. Wanderlei (Shogun said only if the money was right).
At least that way a Chute Boxe guy can get a win and more importantly a pride guy can win in the octagon for a change lol.
(Anderson and Rampage don’t count in my book as they both had decent experience in a cage prior to signing and yes I realise Wandy and Shogun have also fought in a cage before but it’s not the same for them as they don’t have as much experience.)
[quote comment=”157521″][quote comment=”157474″][quote comment=”157472″]Houston Alexander needs to fight Tito next. I want to see his cardio and ground game tested before even thinking of a title shot.[/quote]
And if he ends up crushing Tito like he did the other two, great, then everyone wins!![/quote]
Was thinking this the other day, however, what happens if Rashad wins (again) ?
I honestly would like to see Alexander fight the American Pysco. Stephen can fight from a distance and I dont think he has been knocked out. I believe many have counted him out too quickly. I think with Jardine’s and Griffin’s recent victories we might want to revaluate him.
Peace
Peace[/quote]
I think Bonnar/Alexander would be a decent fight if Bonnar is smart enough to keep some distance and not clinch with him. I think Bonnar could submit him if he can weather that initial onslaught.
Bonnar has a decent chin, but Bonnar was stopped due to cuts by Machida. I know that’s not a ko, but he was roughed up pretty badly, it wasn’t just a single lucky cut. That being said, I think Machida would take Houston Alexander’s lunch money. Machida may be boring, but he’s a very good fighter. I think he could easily bore his way to the top five of lhw division.
Personally, I still really wanna c Chuck vs. Wandy, not as a main event, but it has to happen. We have been awaiting this fight for 5 years and If Jardine ruined it for us, I will hate him forever. What could motivate Chuck more than knowing the Axe Murder is comming to rip his head off?
Machida in know way deserves to be in a #1 contender match. He still hasnt beaten ne 1, and cant finish a fight.
Houston Alexander, athough very exciting, does not deserve a #1 contender match either. Come on now, he beat Jardine and Sakara and some of you have annointed him as an MMA God already. If Chuck vs. Wandy doesnt happen, I would like to see Houston vs. Wandy.
I have no idea who will fight Rampage next. I dont really think anyone deserves to fight him. Sure Forrest beat Shogun, but that was not the Shogun that I was used to seeing. His cardio was crap, and the look in his eyes seemed to be full of nerves and Octagon Jitters. Also Forrest is only on a 2 fight winning streak, to me that isnt up to par with #1 contender status.
Im curious to see who Arona’s fist fight will be against.
I think chuck still has the potential to be the best fighter in his weight class, fame might have gone to his head a little bit but he is still explosive and very dangerous standing up. Jardine did very well with his kicks but I think he’s still too sloppy as a fighter, he exposed himself quite a few times with his unusual style of fighting and think was very very lucky not to be caught by one of chucks ’sledge hammer’ cracks to the face.
Chuck surprised me a lot this time, he still easily had the potential to win the fight. I think if he did another Tito Ortiz explosive KO style for a full on 10 seconds Jardine would of got caught and dropped like a sack of spuds. As other people have said in their comments he’s fighting other world class MMA fighters and has to adapt to their styles.. you will not last forever in the octagon if you are repeatedly known for your stand up skills. Its time he learnt more on takedowns, kicks and submissions instead of standing there looking like he’s waiting for a bus after Jardine popped the same damn combo on him 100 times I mean surely he could of worked it out and capitalized on it. I think what chuck needs to do is take a few weeks break and relax get his losses out of his head and start full on training when he gets back with a clear head. Silva is my favorite fighter in the whole of MMA and if anyone can mach up to Chucks stand up skills it’s definitely Silva! Although as Silva is used to Pride rules I think it will be a little difficult for him to adapt to UFC rules even though it wont be his first time. But somehow if he does end up having to fight Silva in December and has another loss I can guarantee you he will retire. Plus finally if he does accept the fight he’s going to have the most pressure on him than he has ever had in his life, coming off two losses and then having to fight one of the best stand up men in the business to regain his title has got to be something to make you shit yourself before you walk into that octagon.
Why is everyone disrespecting Jardine? He’s handily beaten two marquee names in his last three fights. I love Forrest, but Jardine should definitely be in front of him when it comes to a title shot. The only guys who should be considered for a title shot along with Jardine are Wandy and Houston. All three of those guys need one more win over a quality guy before they should get the title shot. That’s why in December, Wandy should fight either Houston or Jardine for a shot at the title.
That being said, due to his popularity and name recognition, Forrest will probably get the nod for Wandy and then, if he wins, Quentin.
As for Chuck, like Dana said, his heart isn’t in this anymore. He’s like Tito, where he now enjoys his celebrity status too much. My friend said he saw an advertisement that Chuck would be making an appearance at the Orange County (that’s in California) Nordstrom on THE DAY OF THE FIGHT. I don’t know if Chuck actually went, but if he did, and it would be consistent with reports of his behavior prior to his fight with Quentin, his priorities are certainly messed up. Maybe a trip to obscurity, the ticket stamped by Quentin and Jardine, will bring back Chuck’s eye of the tiger.
Forrest beat the best in the world (Maurico Rua) give him his title shot now. Especially from a marketing point of view, it makes more sense to have your TUF 1 winner fight for the crown. It is time that The Ultimate Fighter series actually has a champion, it makes for a great story. For the Matt Serra fans, no he does not count, he will be forgotten quicker than the chick from American Idol who had nude pictures surface on the internet.
Forrest has nothing to prove, zero !
1. Machida needs two more wins because he just isn’t too well known among casual fans. He probably needs to beat someone like Tito Ortiz and Houston Alexander.
2. Keith Jardine is 1-1 since his win over Forrest. He needs one very very solid win or two wins to get the title shot. One win over Wanderlei Silva ORRRRR wins over Dan Henderson then a win over Hosuton Alexander in a re match would leave no doubts.
Forrest and Jackson would be so easy to pump up to bring in 2008 and it would be a classic blood bath. Those two would definitly need hospital visits after the fight. No after parties following….
I still want to see Liddell vs Silva. I’ve wanted to see it for years and just because they don’t have momentum behind them at the moment doesn’t change anything. Silva is riding a two fight losing streak and now so is chuck. big deal. They’re not the dominant champs they used to be but I’m sure it’d still be an awesome fight. A challenge both men would train like hell for.
I was really hoping to see Chuck Lidell fight Wanderlei Silva, but he lost as expected….Now I wanna see Wanderlei fight Rampage again cuz rampage might be able to get a win now the 3rd time they fight. Also it will be nice to see forest griffin take another chute boxe ex member n step up w/ TUF fighters
Chuck would have lost to Wanderlei and I a good match up would be Dan Henderson n Chuck both in 205
To back up my point of view, look at it this way. Guys like Keith Jardine who speak in monotone and may as well be deaf mutes, just dont get fans excited leading up to a fight. I mean how can you possibly sell 1 million PPV’s with Jardine in a championship fight. He is classicly boring.
Luke Cummo playing chess and eating oats is far more entertaining than Keith Jardine in interviews.
For the people who think that personality and interviews have nothing to do with the sport, take a look at Gabriel Gonzaga. Let’s see how many more big fights he has in his future. You can’t speak english, you get no big exposure.
Luke at Luke Cummo, that guy will never be on a UFC live PPV main card. You can’t market or build up a fight with a guy who has said a total of 17 words in 3 years with the UFC.
Being a very good fighter only gets you so far.
how would we go about persuading the UFC to give this fight?
[quote comment=”157536″][quote comment=”157521″][quote comment=”157474″][quote comment=”157472″]Houston Alexander needs to fight Tito next. I want to see his cardio and ground game tested before even thinking of a title shot.[/quote]
And if he ends up crushing Tito like he did the other two, great, then everyone wins!![/quote]
Was thinking this the other day, however, what happens if Rashad wins (again) ?
I honestly would like to see Alexander fight the American Pysco. Stephen can fight from a distance and I dont think he has been knocked out. I believe many have counted him out too quickly. I think with Jardine’s and Griffin’s recent victories we might want to revaluate him.
Peace
Peace[/quote]
I think Bonnar/Alexander would be a decent fight if Bonnar is smart enough to keep some distance and not clinch with him. I think Bonnar could submit him if he can weather that initial onslaught.
Bonnar has a decent chin, but Bonnar was stopped due to cuts by Machida. I know that’s not a ko, but he was roughed up pretty badly, it wasn’t just a single lucky cut. That being said, I think Machida would take Houston Alexander’s lunch money. Machida may be boring, but he’s a very good fighter. I think he could easily bore his way to the top five of lhw division.[/quote]
Cmon,
I just watched the jungle fight video. Hey, the first few minutes of the fight I was grateful for your post. Machida really had Bonnar figured. However, as I contemplated the smaller ring and the fight I could see Bonnar connecting with his right, some knees off the clinch and starting to take the fight as machida gassed. Hard to tell, but the cut under Bonnar’s eye looked to be a head but. Bonnar is better served in the octagon and machida’s strengths are personified in the smaller space with a taller opponent. Who knows - I am still learning the game. I do think Bonnar fights too much on his toes and leads too much with his head - leading to a telegraphing of his offense. Machida looked smart but beatable.
Machida V Alexander Ok
Machida V Bonnar Better IMO
[quote post=”3414″]Fidel Cashflow
Sep 24th, 2007 at 12:37 pm Quote this comment
how would we go about persuading the UFC to give this fight? [/quote]
Guess you would have to start some sort of a petition, but still Rules are Rules dont think it will happen in December but could be quite likely in the future.
I ment to say bonnar v alexander Better
Peace
Taped Up, I just watched that fight again, and you’re right about Bonnar starting to take the fight toward the end. He was definitely exchanging, and he caught Machida with a nasty knee in the clinch just before they stopped the fight. Bonnar clearly wasn’t beaten down, but he was bleeding a lot. I guess they were more averse to blood in JF than the UFC.
In addition to the smaller ring, that fight was only Bonnar’s fourth pro fight (it was Machida’s second!) He’s come a loong way since then. I’m dieing to see how training with Couture has helped him, he really needed a change in his training to improve. I agree that Bonnar/Alexander would be a much more entertaining fight for the fans than Machida/Alexander. Machida is a bad man, but mostly because he dictates the pace of his fights and frustrates his opponents, which = a lot less action.
Chuck simply refuses to adjust himself to new situations. He doesn’t see any problems partying. He does not see any problems in the way he trains. He is just stubborn. Couture success occurred because he realized what he had to do to be better. He realized his short falls against Chuck and modified his game some, cleared his conscious and train like never before. The thing is, you cannot believe your own hype. As in the old west, there will always be someone faster then you, the thing is how well can you manage that.
Cmon,
Definitely, I agree with all your points. Stay tuned, Bonnar is on an upcoming card. Looks like they are feeding him one for his morale and UFC future marketing.
Peace
[quote comment=”157608″]To back up my point of view, look at it this way. Guys like Keith Jardine who speak in monotone and may as well be deaf mutes, just dont get fans excited leading up to a fight. I mean how can you possibly sell 1 million PPV’s with Jardine in a championship fight. He is classicly boring.
Luke Cummo playing chess and eating oats is far more entertaining than Keith Jardine in interviews.
For the people who think that personality and interviews have nothing to do with the sport, take a look at Gabriel Gonzaga. Let’s see how many more big fights he has in his future. You can’t speak english, you get no big exposure.
Luke at Luke Cummo, that guy will never be on a UFC live PPV main card. You can’t market or build up a fight with a guy who has said a total of 17 words in 3 years with the UFC.
Being a very good fighter only gets you so far.[/quote]
Poor Luke, that’s harsh lol…His striking is exciting to watch I think. I think he’s a bit eccentric, bit of character but hey that’s just my 2 cents.
Houston Alexander is like Arturo Gatti. Not a world-class fighter, but I love watching him fight.
[quote post=”3414″]Machida does not deserve to be in a #1 contender fight. Actually, he doesn’t even deserve to fight ANYONE in the UFC Top 10. What has he done in the UFC besides pull off a couple of decsions that are so boring, that most of them go from supposed to be televised, to not being televised. Also, Decision wins over Sam Hoger, David Heath, and Nakamura do not get you a #1 contender match!
I see what you’re saying, but I would like to see him fight a well known fighter. I’m not sure if Houston Alexander would be considered top 10, but a match against Machida would be a good one. [/quote]
That sounds perfect to me. Machida/Alexander. The man that can’t finish a fight to save his life, and the man that looks to kill you in under 60 seconds. The winner of the fight would be declared a contender for sure, possibly even ready to fight in a #1 contender match against maybe Keith Jardine. That’s assuming that Forrest is now the #1 contender.
[quote post=”3414″]Forrest beat the best in the world (Maurico Rua) give him his title shot now. [/quote]
After this weekends performance, its silly to think that Shogun was truely the best in the world. I firmly believe Rampage and Juanito’s claims. I was utterly shocked to hear this at first, but after seeing him and his brother fight recently, I am a believer of the accusations!!!
If Shogun didn’t buzz his head before the fight and he looked like he did in all the pre-fight stuff, after watching his performance, I would have thought that it was some sort of body double. I would not have thought that that was Mauricio Shogun Rua.
[quote post=”3414″] was really hoping to see Chuck Lidell fight Wanderlei Silva, but he lost as expected….[/quote]
LOL, where were you every day leading up to the fight? I think there was only 1 or 2 people saying that Jardine would win the fight outright…
[quote comment=”157392″]Chuck needs to set up the right hand with kicks. The one trick pony thing has been exposed .[/quote]
Yeah, I’m with you, man.
Maybe I’m in denial, but all this talk of “the old Chuck” and “no fire” just seems like excuses to me. Jardine is a tough guy and had the ability to avoid Chuck’s right hand — end of story. We all know that Chuck has come to rely on the right too heavily, and when it didn’t land, he has no other answer.
If one of those rights would have landed and put Jardine to sleep, would everyone be saying Chuck lacked fire? I doubt it.
Honestly, I almost don’t even care to see Silva-Liddell anymore. That fight was thought of when those two guys were on top of the sport. Both are coming off two losses now. It’s still somewhat an interesting fight, but definitely not what it used to be. At this point, it’d be a fight to see if either man still has it and is still what they used to be. That’s not the same as it was a few years ago, when the two men considered to be the best in the sport would have met in a fight.
If it ends up happening in December, I guess it would be cool, but then again it would almost be shameful. The two once considered to be the greatest fighters in the world would be in a fight that mma fans have waited for for so long, and it wouldn’t even be main event status. What a shame.
Mr.Lidell, you may put on a humble show when your interviewed and talk in low-tones. You did try but your efforts at taking your time to “spot-light” with Keith, making him wait for the likes of “you” well, Mr. small-thought for brains, you ebarrassed yourself. I lost alot of respect after the televised weighin. You have now felt the sting of defeat and a quiet message for you to stop the invinsible role. Keith Jardine, you did show that you are determined and from that you are a honor to UFC. Great beat-down victory over this arrogant, soon to be lost in history, liddell.
[quote comment=”157798″]Mr.Lidell, you may put on a humble show when your interviewed and talk in low-tones. You did try but your efforts at taking your time to “spot-light” with Keith, making him wait for the likes of “you” well, Mr. small-thought for brains, you ebarrassed yourself. I lost alot of respect after the televised weighin. You have now felt the sting of defeat and a quiet message for you to stop the invinsible role. Keith Jardine, you did show that you are determined and from that you are a honor to UFC. Great beat-down victory over this arrogant, soon to be lost in history, liddell.[/quote]
LOL
I know Dana is covering his tracks with these statement, but I agree with him entirely. Liddell is done
it’s amazing how 75% of you guys don’t know anything at all about the ufc, no guys aren’t gonna fight after 2 months rest especially if he just fought 3 rounds, and no there will be not tournaments or any of that after what happened with the light weight belt when bj penn and caol uno fought for a draw.
lidell shouldn’t retire, and pull a randy on us in a year or so. some fighters have lost twice and a row like andre arlovski, bj penn, look at wanderli silva and diego sanchez there both in back to back loses are they quitting even though sanchez is moving down in weight to get his butt kicked by griffin, florian, penn, stevenson, huerta, fisher, light weight isn’t any easier. lidell needs to take a 6 month break or so relax retool, maybe even go to randy couture camp. even tim slyvia lost two in a row to frank mir and andre arlovki
One and your done? Doubt it! Lose two in a row and you’re washed up? Maybe. Lose three in a row and you’re on skid row? Definitely! I think Chuck Liddell’s loss of invincibility is as much of a shock to him as it is to us. I saw a fighter that didn’t want to #1 Get Hit, #2 Throw combinations and #3 Just plain got lazy. It’s time to dump John Hackelman and the one punch knockout approach. There are too many other trainers and camps out there that can improve his game, I hear “Extreme Couture” has turned a couple of careers around and resurrected a retired fighter! There is plenty of gas left in the tank, this isn’t boxing where you take massive head trauma for 12 rounds. Chuck needs to get his head together, not rush into another fight and for Christ sake stop the late night partying in SLO and Vegas. Liddell and Wanderlei get it on in December and Chuck KO’s “The Axe Murderer” in two!
Seriously what the hell happened with these pride fighters? I hope to god Wandy does better. I guess some just don’t acclimate to the change in organizations with the rules, crowd, and whole cage seen, as well as others. Can’t say they all do bad though, after all, one of the pride fighters is holding the belt.
He should just retire already. I’m tired of hearing how Golden Boy Chuck this, and that. Move into acting, thats what he likes doing. The fighting got him to this level of fame, and now just move on.
it’s funny how chuck loses two fights, and people are like “its ok, he’ll be back” but Mirko loses two and “oh he’s finished”
Yet Mirko fought with more heart, even though he was actually HURT in both his last losses. Chuck just looked like shite.
[quote post=”3414″]it’s funny how chuck loses two fights, and people are like “its ok, he’ll be back” but Mirko loses two and “oh he’s finished”[/quote]
I don’t think anybody says that.
Putting liddel vs. silva is all about two things:
1: First and what should be foremost-giving the fans what they have long desired.
2: Even though not a headline fight this fight will still cause many (myself included) to pop down $40 for ppv without even thinking. I mean it really doesn’t matter who headlines, this will still be the fight with the most fan interest!
[quote comment=”157945″][quote post=”3414″]it’s funny how chuck loses two fights, and people are like “its ok, he’ll be back” but Mirko loses two and “oh he’s finished”[/quote]
I don’t think anybody says that.[/quote]
Well I have read alot, Sherdog and what not, certain users really that say Mirko should just give up for what happened to him. But Chuck will get all the support he needs. Of course this is a rampant amount of users saying this, but more than necessary.
[quote post=”3414″]Houston Alexander needs to fight Tito next. I want to see his cardio and ground game tested before even thinking of a title shot. [/quote]
Houston is an animal ,for the first two minutes. He was breathing very hard after both fights and they only lasted just over a minute. Tito should be able to weather the 2 minute storm and let Houston blow his wad and then GnP a gassed Alexander. Tito has to block all his strike though, because Houston follows up accurately and mercilessly.
[quote comment=”157939″]Seriously what the hell happened with these pride fighters? I hope to god Wandy does better. I guess some just don’t acclimate to the change in organizations with the rules, crowd, and whole cage seen, as well as others. Can’t say they all do bad though, after all, one of the pride fighters is holding the belt.[/quote]
2 pride fighters are holding belts.
At this point in time, I don’t ever see Chuck being ranked much higher than Houston Alexander. As a matter of fact, in the next ranking that fmr it - it wouldn’t suprise mel
[quote comment=”157405″]At this point I don’t really care about Liddell-Silva anymore. If they make that fight it should be called UFC 78 - Has Beens.[/quote]
You responed to soon without thinking this issue through, first off if you have been an mma fan for any time you would realize that this fight is still a dream fight headliner for sure, I agree with holdin ropes approach to the situation.
[quote comment=”159095″][quote comment=”157405″]At this point I don’t really care about Liddell-Silva anymore. If they make that fight it should be called UFC 78 - Has Beens.[/quote]
You responed to soon without thinking this issue through, first off if you have been an mma fan for any time you would realize that this fight is still a dream fight headliner for sure, I agree with holdin ropes approach to the situation.[/quote]
this guy clearly knows very little about mixed martial arts and the story so far…….. First off, was rampage a has been then as he holds losses to top fighters one of which being Silva, the guy you are slating, not once but twice!! No hes not cos guess what, he came back and fought hard and produced a sterling performance over the beast and then the Iceman. This game is so unpredictable its exciting, yet you are writing off two of the most dangerous strikers/fighters in the mma world!! Go and play video games for you know little of mma mad man!!